In January, I was fortunate to be able to conduct
the following interview with leading Swiss revisionist researcher, author
and scholar Jürgen Graf. Graf is the author of countless articles
and has authored the devastating analysis of Raul Hilberg’s work,
The Giant with Feet of Clay. He has also co-authored with
Carlo Mattogno several of the most important analyses of various concentration
camps including: Treblinka: Extermination Camp or Transit Camp?,
Concentration Camp Majdanek: A Historical and Technical Study,
and Concentration Camp Stutthof and its Function in National Socialist
Jewish Policy. Jürgen Graf was born in Switzerland in 1951.
He studied Scandinavian, English and Roman languages at the University
of Basel where he was awarded the degree of Magister. For four
years he taught German at the Chinese Culture University in Taipai,
Taiwan. He has researched and authored various revisionist works
since 1991. In 1998, he was, on account of his
revisionist books and related writings on the Holocaust, sentenced to
15 months imprisonment without probation at Baden, Switzerland, on the
ridiculous charge of “racial discrimination.” Since 2002,
Graf has been in exile. Most recently, Graf has been living in
Russia with his wife Olga, a historian from Minsk.
What have you been working on recently?
Graf: Unfortunately the circumstances do not allow
me to carry out any research. Since 2002, I have only published about
ten articles, most of which appeared in Vierteljahreshefte
für freie Geschichtsforschung. As you know, there will be
no more issues of this fine journal, but I can always write in Sans
Concessions, a journal edited by French revisionist Vincent Reynouard,
who recently published my attack on Guillaume Faye (“The new
Jewish question” or the end of Guillaume Faye) and will also
publish my article about the number of victims of the Majdanek Concentration
Camp, which is at present being translated into English.
However, I have found the time to
write a very large book for the Russian market. It was translated into
Russian by historian Anatoli Ivanov and will probably come out in April
this year. The title is The New World Order and the Holocaust.
Like Germar Rudolf’s Lectures on the Holocaust, the book has
the form of a dialogue. A German lecturer, whom I christened Dr. Friedrich
Bruckner, is holding a seminar at a Russian institute for the benefit
of students who are specializing in German history. About 5% of the
contents are taken from Lectures on the Holocaust; it goes without
saying that I duly acknowledge this.
Tell us something about your book Holocaust
Revisionism. The arguments.
Graf: I wrote this booklet in 1996. If I had to
write it today, I would of course add a huge amount of new information,
as revisionist research has greatly progressed since 1996. Nevertheless
I think that the booklet still is a pretty good introduction to revisionism.
– Somebody told me the translation contains one or two glaring errors.
I have never seen the printed version.
What is the case the Swiss government has against
you?
Graf: In 1998, I went on trial in Baden, Switzerland,
for my first four revisionist books plus the brochure About the decline
of Swiss freedom. Together with my editor Gerhard Förster, who was
so sick at the time of the trial that he had to be brought into the
courtroom in a wheelchair, I had been accused of “racial discrimination”
on the basis of the “Anti-Racism law” which forbids unspecified crimes
such as “denying or minimizing genocide or other crimes against humanity”.
This law had been introduced at the behest of Switzerland’s Jewish community.
I was sentenced to 15 months in prison without probation and a fine
of about 40.000 Swiss francs; Förster got 12 months without probation
plus an fine, but he died in September, nine weeks after the trial.
Of course, the judge did not make the slightest effort to discuss the
arguments exposed in my books. After the Supreme Court had confirmed
the verdict, I went into exile on August 15, 2000, my 49th
birthday. Should I return now, I would most probably face a new accusation
because of the books and articles which I wrote abroad and which are
on the Internet, and the fine, which I am of course unable to pay, would
be transformed into an additional prison term. Altogether I would presumably
go to prison for two to three years. Neither my wife Olga nor myself
are willing to accept such a long separation voluntarily.
On my website Jürgen-graf.nm
ru you can find a long article in the English language which I wrote
in Teheran in late 2000 and which contains additional information about
my trial. The title of the article is Holocaust Revisionism and
its Political Consequences.
Is there any chance that the anti-revisionist
laws will be abolished in at least some of the European countries which
have adopted them?
Graf: The decision of Spain’s Supreme Court came
as a great and pleasant surprise to me, but I am afraid it is an isolated
case. In Spain, the Jews are by no means as powerful as in Germany,
Austria, France, or Switzerland. Unlike the three first countries, Switzerland
has the institution of the “popular initiative”, which means that any
party, organization or group can enforce a plebiscite about introducing
a new law or abolishing an existing one if it gathers 50.000 signatures
within one year. In August 2007, the “Swiss Democrats”, a small right-wing
party, launched such an initiative to seek the abolition of the “Anti-Racism
Law”, but on their own, they will not possibly be able to gather 100,000
signatures. On the other hand, collecting them will be very easy if Christoph Blocher, the most popular politician of the country, who was
recently kicked out of the government, supports the initiative. Although
he has criticized the “Anti-Racism Law” and demanded its abolition,
I doubt that he will muster the necessary courage to back the initiative.
Such a step would constitute a declaration of war against the Jews,
and Blocher is the owner of a large company, which the Jews will spare
no effort to ruin if the acts against them. – According to an opinion
poll in the Zurich weekly Die Weltwoche, a slight majority of
the population favors abolishing the law. But in case of a vote, the
possibility of fraud is very real.
What do you consider the most important revisionist
discoveries of the last years?
Graf: The archeological excavations on the site
of the alleged “extermination camp” Belzec (Eastern Poland) and three
documents which Mattogno and I found in Russian archives and which prove
with absolute certainty that the morgues of the Birkenau crematoria
could not possibly have been used as homicidal gas chambers, as the
orthodox historians claim.
Ironically, the first of these two
discoveries was made possible thanks to the abysmal stupidity of the
exterminationists. In 2000, the Holocaust Memorial Museum and a similar
Polish organization published a book about the excavations at Belzec
(Andrzej Kola, Belzec. The Nazi camp for Jews in the Light of Archeological
Sources. Excavations 1997-1999, Warsaw/Washington 2000).
Kola pretended to have found material evidence corroborating that Belzec
had indeed been an extermination camp. But as Carlo Mattogno brilliantly
demonstrates in his book Belzec in Propaganda, Testimonies, Archeological
Research and History (Theses & Dissertation Press, Chicago 2004),
the results of the excavations conclusively show that only some thousand
people perished at Belzec, while the orthodox historians claim 600.000
victims. The presence of human remains on the site of the camp can easily
explained by two factors: In 1941, Belzec had been a very inhumanely
ruled labor camp before becoming a transit camp in March 1942, and between
March and December 1942, 434.000 Jews were deported to this camp before
being transferred either into the occupied Eastern Territories or to
labor camps in the Lublin district. (The figure of 434.000 results from
a German document, the “Höfle telegram”, which is doubtless authentic
but constitutes no evidence of mass murder, as David Irving mendaciously
claims.) Unavoidably, a certain number of these 434.000 Jews must have
died at Belzec. – Moreover the excavations showed that the two “gas
chambers” described by witnesses never existed. By ordering these excavations
and foolishly publishing their results, the Holocaust Memorial Museum
and its Polish friends have furnished irrefutable evidence that Belzec
was not an extermination camp.
The three documents about the Birkenau
crematoria were published and commented in Carlo Mattogno’s article
„Die Leichenkeller der Krematorien von Birkenau im Lichte der Dokumente“
(Vierteljahreshefte für freie Geschichtsforschung 3/2003).
Their background is a very gloomy one: Birkenau was infested
by rats which feasted on the corpses of deceased prisoners (in 1943,
the daily mortality at Auschwitz and Birkenau was about 80, the main
cause being spotted fever and other diseases). On 20 July 1943, a German
physician, SS-Hauptsturmführer Dr. Wirths, wrote a letter to the chief
of the Zentralbauleitung (Central Construction Office) of Auschwitz,
Karl Bischoff, urging him to set up “Leichenkammern (“corpse
chambers”, i. e. provisional morgues) in the camp in order to reduce
the number of rats; being the carriers of bubonic plague, these beasts
could provoke an outbreak of this dread disease which would have had
“unimaginable consequences” (Wirths). On 4 August, Bischoff replied
that such “corpse chambers” were not necessary, as the dead bodies would
from now on be taken to the crematoria twice a day. This means that
the morgues of the crematoria, which allegedly served as gas chambers,
could be used at any time for storing corpses prior to cremation and
could not possibly be used as gas chambers. – In May 1944, the problem
seems to have appeared again, for on the 22th the new chief of the Central
Construction Office, Jothann, answering a new letter on the subject,
stated that he would order the corpses to be taken to the crematoria
every morning. According to the orthodox historians, up to 400.000 Hungarian
Jews were gassed at Birkenau between mid-May and early July 1944. If
this were true, the morgues would have been used as gas chambers all
the time, so how could any corpses have been stored there!
It would really be interesting what
Robert Jan van Pelt, Deborah Lipstadt or Michael Berenbaum would answer
if confronted with these documents. We can easily understand why these
people are mortally afraid of an open debate.
Which revisionist researchers do you consider
the most important ones?
Graf: In alphabetical order: Arthur Butz, Robert
Faurisson, Carlo Mattogno, Germar Rudolf and Wilhelm Stäglich. Due credit
must also be given to the pioneer, the great Frenchman Paul Rassinier,
even if his books contain many errors (which is normal for any pioneer).
Are new revisionist books still necessary, or
is it sufficient to spread the existing ones?
Graf: Spreading the existing books – especially
Dissecting the Holocaust and Lectures on the Holocaust
– is very important indeed, but the task of revisionist researchers
is far from finished. Already in 2002, Germar Rudolf, Carlo Mattogno
and myself planned to write a huge documentation about Auschwitz,
Auschwitz: The Real History. But Germar is now in jail; Carlo (who
would write the bulk of the work) and I have the material, but we lack
the necessary resources and have no editor. Otherwise the book could
be ready in about 15 to 18 months; if we had a qualified translator
(who would of course have to be paid adequately), he or she could translate
every chapter as soon as it would be available in German, and the two
versions could come out together.
Do you see any chances for a revisionist breakthrough?
Graf: I only see two possible scenarios:
1) A huge economic crises which will lead to the
collapse of the Jewish-dominated “democratic” system of the West. If
authentic Nationalists come to power in either the USA or some major
European countries, the hoax will of course be doomed.
2) A confrontation between the Jewish puppet regime
in Washington and Russia which will induce Moscow to deal Washington
a deadly blow by publishing documents proving that the “extermination
camps” belong to the realm of propaganda. There can be no doubt whatsoever
that the Russians have such documents.
In the meantime, what can we American revisionists
do?
Graf: Continue spreading the truth to those who
want to hear it!