The CODOH Revisionist Forum November 2011

This is a selection of Forum topics initiated in November 2011 and responses to them. These are generally condensed versions of the threads involved. Most topics contain much more broad, robust, and elaborate replies than space allows here. Only on rare occasion are thread topics locked, hence most will be open for further response. I invite any and all participants.

Visit the forum yourself at:

http://www.codoh.com

‘Holocaust Controversies’ problems / images

A grumpy anti-Revisionist, ‘leemadison’, from another website starts off.

“This seems so stupid to believe that Holocaust never occurred, there are people who have given stories about what happened in camps, there is the actual book of Schindler's list and many generations today still go to Schindler's grave and thank him for saving lives of many Jews. If all of this is false then i am so sorry i have no idea about this world. It is sad to hear that people question about an incident which led to death of many innocent people and their plight.”

Note to ‘leemadison’

– “Please read our guidelines, after all, you accepted them when you registered. Your speaking in nonspecifics, affirming your belief in the so called "Holocaust" is in no way providing proof for your belief. What we do here is discuss / debate specifics. If you think you can defend your position then we welcome the opportunity to debate you. If you're just going to engage in substance-less ad hominem, then you are posting to the wrong forum. Thank you, Moderator”

DNA can be found from bones and ashes

This thread discusses the article and video in the link given below. http://tinyurl.com/yd82sqk The ramifications of the article & video as related to the ‘holocaust’ storyline is what concerns the forum’s participants.

– “ … the bones can still be shown to be Jewish or not, and even the 'ash' can be shown to be Jewish. Surprising enough, we just have to find said bodies. The problem is though, the bodies of all the mass graves in the 6 camps are not even there, because if they were, we would have heard about it.”

– “Even IF mass graves were ever produced…Even IF bones and ash were tested…Even IF those bones and ash were found to be Jewish…Dead Jews don't mean murdered Jews.”

– “All perfectly true, and even if it could be proved they were murdered Jews, thousands of people of all nationalities were murdered during WW2 by troops of many nationalities. Murder, even on a substantial scale, doesn't prove extermination.”

– “A few years ago a mass grave near Stuttgart with about 20 dead bodies was found. The German quality press and the Central Council of Jews claimed that they are very probably dead Jews from a camp in Alsace. The public prosecution office wanted to investigate the crime and make DNA analysis. But the Central Council of Jews immediately protested because "the peace of the dead would be disturbed" they said. So the ministry has banned the prosecutor from further investigation.

The Jews have no interest in such investigations. They know well that there are hardly any Jews among the tens of millions of victims of war. It is quite sure that the dead from Stuttgart are Germans who were murdered after the war by the French occupiers.”

– “Jews can't have it both ways. Either they are willing to prove it, or they are not.”

– “For everyone out there that wants to know a little bit behind this, they "proved" that they were real Jews, and not the fake ones that people have been saying that they are. http://tinyurl.com/7ka33bz – ”Therein lies the problem for anyone who researches any aspect of the Holocaust. The standard story requires a person to believe that any dead body in the designated areas must be Jewish AND must have been murdered by Germans. Otherwise, the story doesn't hold water. The idea that anyone could die from any cause or at the hands of anyone other than Germans only clogs the myth toilet.”

– “Well, according to one believer, (can't remember the quote right now) ONLY Germans can commit genocide – nobody else!”

Engineering evil

A discussion of a History Channel television program, plus comments on reviews of the program:

– “New show premieres tonight on the good ol "history" channel. Promises to have "never-before-seen" footage and "proof" of the holocaust.”

– “To claim ‘never-before-seen footage and proof’ is part of their strategy of desperation, they say it so frequently. It's really just a weak & shallow attempt to claim they have refuted Revisionists. Every time they try this “new information” nonsense it turns out to be the same old absurdities which have been debunked repeatedly. And why would they need to claim "never before seen footage and proof" while claiming the whole matter has long ago been fixed as "established fact" and the "most documented event in history"? Obviously they feel their grip is slipping … and it is.”

– “Emotional blackmail triumphs over common sense and evidence. Reading this reminds me of just what an emotional topic the Holocaust is for a lot of people. The keywords, "Extermination", "Holocaust", "six million" used to stir a huge emotional response in me and the others in my class… Of course in lessons nowadays I don't feel sad about it at all, in fact I can barely refrain from laughing in the face of laughable testimonies…” – http://tinyurl.com/8xk6nfw

– “Engineering Evil,” a History Channel special on Tuesday night, is devoted to the details of how the Nazis carried out the Holocaust, so you expect to learn about things like crematorium design, and you do. But another kind of engineering — call it human engineering — is also revealed here.”

– "Crematorium designs"? The ones that couldn't possibly have cremated all the bodies claimed? More nonsense about gas chambers and ovens. The crematoria had a hygienic function, and the real gas chambers saved lives.”

– “One of the reasons the Holocaust is so preposterous to believe is that the Nazis notoriously kept records of virtually everything— except its planning, construction and execution, such as the resettlement lists of those transported to the East (doesn't that contradict the Holocaust?) , to the blueprints, permits and contracts of those involved in creating the concentration camps.”

– “Where is this mass grave? Are they Jews?”

– “Once again the Holocaust is a religion, something unquestionable which nobody can ever change.”

– “Apparently this person doesn't believe that people actually lie, and believes there are no reasons for people to lie. Using his/her logic requires accepting the vastly more numerous 'eyewitnesses' / 'survivors' of witchcraft & sorcery which was said to be scientific fact as determined in courts of law. I love debating these types. The anger they feel when they can't rebut Revisionist research is something to behold. I do find it humorous. They believe because they want to believe. Rational folks would be glad to hear that 6M Jews and another 5-6M 'others' were not murdered. I always like to ask them for specifics of each 'survivors' story, if they even know it. From there you shoot it down piece by contradicting piece. The more people talk about the claimed storyline, the worse it becomes. The classic example of that is Pressac's 'gas chamber' book. It was supposed to be the definitive work. But what happened was just the opposite. The more he wrote the deeper the quagmire for the 'holocaust' Industry.”

Inconvenient History, Goebbels on the Jews

A discussion of: Part 1:

http://tinyurl.com/6pxqko3

Part 2: http://tinyurl.com/7rjxdoe

– “Why would he speak of the Jews coming back, if he meant to exterminate them?”

– “Goebbels : ‘In the POW camps, many are dying.’ From the wording, this implies dying, not murder; as in disease etc. I really hope the Goebbels diaries will get a full translation into English sometime. It's amazing such an important historical document has never been fully translated.”

“Goebbels: ‘Aber wenn sie sich weigern, freiwillig zu gehen, sehe ich keinen anderen Weg als die Ausrottung.’ We have long since established that Ausrottung does not mean extermination per se, but "rooting out." It becomes clear he did not mean extermination when we read the sentence that follows: ‘A good three or four hundred years will go by before the Jews set foot again in Europe. They'll return first of all as commercial travelers, then gradually they'll become emboldened to settle here — the better to exploit us…’ Why would he speak of the Jews coming back, if he meant to exterminate them?”

– “So, if i could admit that one could use the figure of rooting out one people from a society and a population, then why would Hitler make a distinction between forced or free emigration which would fit with this definition of ausrottung ? On the contrary, if you accept the literal definition and most commonly accepted translation, that is kill which is what happens to plants which are "rooted out," then if it does not mean to make Jews emigrate, then what does it mean?”

– “Come on Balsamo, you really are behind the curve on the tired old 'ausrottung' canard. Numerous examples debunk your position on it. In 1993, Robert Wolfe, supervisory archivist for captured German records at the National Archives admitted that a more precise translation of 'ausrottung' would be extirpation or tearing up by the roots. Wolfe also pointed out that in Himmler's handwritten notes for a major speech, that Himmler used the term, 'judenevakuierung', or evacuation of the Jews, not 'extermination'. “

– “Soviet Premier Nikita Khrushchev said at the United Nations, directed toward the United States; ‘We will bury you’. There it is, proof that the communists exterminated the people of the U.S.A.”

BBC article on ‘denial’ by Deborah Lipstadt

Deborah Lipstadt is a fanatical anti-Revisionist, famous for being sued by David Irving. She teaches Jewish religion at Emory College. This article, ‘Denying the Holocaust’, http://tinyurl.com/7b4vc9u is the topic. The responses are to the content of the article.

– “So it is Anti Semitic to say the Jews have ever done ANYTHING wrong? Yeah, right. Also, if this woman actually knew about revisionism, she'd know we actually claim the Holocaust propaganda was mainly circulated by the Allies, and then later picked up by the Jews for their own ends.”

– “The reports that may or may not be authentic, and have no supporting evidence, and contradict logic as to what the Einsatzgruppen were meant to be doing? See the chapter: http://tinyurl.com/7gebpal and search the forum. Also, if the Germans were so adamant about destroying the documents referring to killings in the camps, why weren't these alleged documents destroyed? It makes no sense.”

– “She does realize that the Allies, of course, had access to German typewriters after the war. As Butz points out, with the Einsatzgruppen documents, there are only signatures on the non-incriminating pages as well.”

– “We claim that the Final Solution was not what you claim it to be. Nobody denies there was some kind of "Final solution"- but we argue on whether it was murder or deportation.”

– “On so called 'confessions'; we have many threads on the fact that torture and threats were consistently used and there are no trial transcripts to confirm what the claims say. … there are thousands of confessions taken in courts of law which confirm witchcraft and sorcery, complete with 'eyewitnesses' … which dwarf in number the coerced 'holocaust confessions' … 'judicial notice' was given in these show trials which made it nearly impossible for the 'confessors' to say anything but what the sham prosecutors demanded.”

– “alleged Einsatzgruppen mass shootings; there are threads which deal with the complete lack of mass graves that are alleged, they supposedly know where they are, but alas, no human remains. The ‘documents’ make no sense and there’s the lack of provenance for them.”

– “Lipstadt is a racist Jewish supremacist, as she herself has said in so many words. It's another case of 'projection'. The Jewish supremacists project their feelings on to others. A blind man can see what they're doing to the Palestinians and how they cajole Americans into shedding goyim blood for Jewish supremacist interests, see Walt / Mearsheimer, MacDonald, etc. on that fact.”

– “Lipstadt says ‘Holocaust deniers have, thus far, been decidedly unsuccessful in convincing the broader public of their claims’. Oh really?

– Is that why at every turn we see conferences-of-desperation where they try to rally so called 'academia' behind racist Jewish supremacist stands against 'deniers?

– Where they send out the racist JDL-like 'Hillel' members to stop CODOH ads in university newspapers?

– Where we see desperate sham publications like 'The Holocaust Did Really Happen'?

– Where we see arch Zionist, Israel- first Spielberg Shoah Foundation gather nonsensical 'survivors’ (where there should be no 'survivors’ if the tales were true) bizarre and scientifically impossible 'testimonies on film for "posterity", but yet they control who can access these laughable testimonies to senility, groupthink, and the profit motive?

– Where the Arolsen archives, where so much real documentation is held, are accessible to 'approved users only'. Then there's the International Association of Jewish Lawyers and Jurists (IAJLJ) desperately scrambling to get laws against 'holocaust' denial in the U.S. The very existence of such a racist organization is proof of desperation and disregard for others?

– Of course, in the first place, 'holocaust' denial laws that we see in Europe, Canada, Australia, etc. are clear proof that Revisionists are winning the long term battle.

As Thomas Jefferson said, '"Only lies need protection of government, truth can stand on its own".